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So why is there a prison inside of the palace where the ROYAL FAMILY lives? I mean if there was a breakout...
- They send the truly bad people off to Ragou.
- Keep in mind that what they actually have is not a prison, but a set of jail cells. The difference being, holding anybody in those cells is going to be extremely temporary and most of the people in them will be there for minor infractions. When Yuri's down there, all the other cells are empty (except for Raven), and all the Knights know Yuri as "that jerk who would never really hurt people", so it's not surprising that the guard who's supposed to watch him is taking a nap. (For more evidence that the Knights know Yuri isn't a bad guy per se, re-watch the scene where Leblanc & Co., when given the choice between pursuing Yuri and pursuing the Red-Eyes, obviously choose the criminals who are actually a danger to citizens. And this is after kidnapping a princess has been added to Yuri's list of crimes.) Basically: there's hardly anyone in those jail cells for the Royal Family to worry about breaking out. (And also, hardly any Royal Family members actually live in the castle; Ioder, Estelle's only real rival for the throne, grew up outside the Castle.)
"We'll keep playing with you until you die!" Good Lord, Yuri. Yes, yes, it's a battle to the death and he's no softie, but that line sounds like something Zagi would say...for Yuri to direct it at an Entelexaia, completely willing to give her life for the party if only they're strong enough to take it, seems batantly disrespectful and completely out of character for him. It was the only moment I didn't like him.
- I see your point, but it's not like he was being all friendly with Khroma beforehand either. Note that during the pre-battle conversation, he's speaking angrily and narrows his eyes, and seems to have a chip on his shoulder...Why? Well, whenever he had seen her previously, she had been associating with either Alexei, who turned out to be a Complete Monster, or Duke, who's acting suspicious himself -- and though she had just explained that she wasn't with Duke, Yuri's not one to take such a suspicious person at face value. And finally, she's forcing the party into a fight they would rather avoid. Add all those factors to Yuri's normal Blood Knight tendencies, and I can see how he would say something like that.
- But that's just all the more reason it goes against everything we know about Yuri. As far as emotions go, he's a very practical person, not one to waste energy holding grudges. He's also rude, blunt, a deadpan snarker, and yes, a Blood Knight, but is very good at knowing just when and how much respect any given person has earned. So when someone says "I don't trust you, but I'm going to help you anyway. If you can kill me, feel free to use my soul for whatever", and when that someone has saved the party's life once...well, to me that seems worthy of at least a few points in the Yuri Lowell System of Morality. It may not be enough to make him like or fully trust Khroma, but it's out of left field for him to throw out a line like that at her.
- I'm afraid we're going to have to disagree on the respect point -- the only people Yuri gives even an inkling of respect to are the other party members, the Don, and Ioder, and even then he ribs them all pretty good (except the Don). He's a good person, but he's not a nice guy. Again, not to say I don't see your point, I just don't think he's that respectful of others in general.
- Well, there's a difference between respecting someone, showing respect, and being polite. Yuri has his own way of showing the first two -- not so much with the latter.
- Yuri respects people, but only if they show him they deserve it. Note that he respects people a lot of others don't because they show him that they have the resolve to do thing. He respects Estelle and puts up with her nievity because she showed the willingness to get out and do things despite being a noble while the other nobles and knights looked down on her for being too nice. He respects Karol and puts up with his weakness and cowardice while all the other guild people mock him for it because Karol showed Yuri he had a good heart and had guts. He respects Rita despite the other mages thinking of her as a recluse and weirdo because she's shown him she knows her stuff. What he doesn't respect is pure status. He respects the Don and the Fortune's Market leader because they worked hard to get to those positions, but he won't respect the nobles that are useless or that are total assholes to everyone, just because they are nobles.
- Quite right. And this is veering away from the topic at hand, which is Yuri being unusually vicious to Khroma, who is neither a noble nor an asshole nor throwing around her status.
- If you take the literal translation, he's saying something more along the lines of "We'll be your opponents until you die!", which sounds less...sadistic.
What's so special about the lower quarter's fountain? The people spent all their money on fixing it (pre-game) and Yuri goes halfway across the world to get the core back when its stolen. Wouldn't it have been far easier to just say "shit happens" and let the Empire fix it if they happen to feel like it? It's not like it's their only water supply or anything, there is a river right next to it.
- It's mentioned that the river water is of inferior quality, and the residents of the lower quarter will get minor stomach and digestive issues from drinking it.
- Not only that, but to be blunt the lower quarter's needs are pretty low on the Empire's priority list.
- The blastia purifies and filters the water, too. You can't just drink water you find in the river, in most of the world, that'll usually make you sick; and as tropers said above, we know that the river water by the Lower Quarter was no exception.
We know that an apatheia is needed to make a blastia, but can a single apatheia go into making multiple blastia, or can it only be used once? It hit me some time after the ending and I don't recall the game going into detail about this.
- Apatheia aren't really used to "make" blastia so much as they power them as the blastia core. If the core is removed from the body, the blastia won't work, and while multiple bodies can be made, there are a limited number of cores.
- There is a skit in the game that mentions this. Apparently apatheia are too potent to be used without processing, which generally involves breaking it down into several cores.
Shouldn't there be elemental spirits for the light and dark elements? Sure, earth, fire, wind, and water may be the "great four" elements, but light and dark are used to damage enemies dammit. It shouldn't be too hard to add two more entelexia, or would that have involved making the "gathering spirits" part of the story last longer than normal? And yes, I'm aware that this scan implies that spirits can only be made into those elements, but this page is called It Just Bugs Me for a reason.
- Isn't it said or implied that at the end, the component bits of Adephagos and the blastia turn into new spirits? Two of those probably became Light and Dark spirits.
- But we're not shown anything about the new spirits after the ending.
- Because Efreet, Undine, Sylph and Gnome are an iconic foursome. If there were going to be any two added, it would be Celsius and Volt.
- I imagine they probably didn't want to add more sequences where you had to recruit surviving Entelixaia to become Rem and Shadow. Not to mention; there wasn't really anyone introduced earlier who could have fulfilled the role. Khroma was kind of pushing it.
- Also, that would bring up the Rem/Luna conflict. There already is enough speculation about what canon this game ties into, and since it was made by Team Symphonia, they probably didn't want to further separate this from the rest of the series.
- They could've recovered the apatheia Alexei used to control Estelle, which were now just forgotten.
The PlayStation 3 port not being released in America bugs me. Is there a reason why not? Did the 360 version not sell enough? The Play Station 2 port of Tales of Symphonia was eventually released in the US (I think...too lazy to check).
- No, the Play Station 2 version of Tales of Symphonia was never released here, since Nintendo had rights to the script and all.
- The 360 version didn't sell well enough. That's it. People really seem to underestimate the incredible risk of releasing a fully-voiced console JRPG in today's market. They would also have to callback every voice actor to record new lines, which is both expensive and difficult.
- Actually, quotha Troy Baker, they already did the new voice acting recordings. From what I can tell, their plan was to have the voice acting ready, in case they ever had the opportunity to bring over the game. Which was smart, since voice actors age and disappear over the years and just plain lose touch with their characters. I haven't given up on getting the game localized yet; I think it's clear that Namco Bandai would like to, if ever given an opportunity, but I wouldn't hold your breath. When and if it happens, it'll be a very nice surprise.
So I've just saw The First Strike. Let Me Get This Straight...: Yuri "Snark King" Lowell, who quips with the best of them, doesn't get joke his commanding officer made about the twins chests? Really? I find that a little hard to believe. That doesn't mean the scene isn't funny mind you. It just seems odd.
- Then again, the Yuri in The First Strike seemed a lot more tame than the one in the game. I'm guessing that it's because he's younger, and the fact that he'd probably never seen the really ugly bits of the world (outside the lower quarter) before joining the Knights. Then he got a little more battle-hardened after having to kill Lambert and watch his squad captain die. So he might have been a teeny, tiny LIIIIIIIIIITTLE bit more innocent. But not much. Or he's just never been bothered or perverted enough to pay attention to Hisca and Chastel's busts.
- Not to mention that snark =/= perversion. Yuri's pretty much a Celibate Hero. The only time in the game he makes a comment outright bordering on lewd, Judith invited him too. He teases people, but he respects personal boundaries.
- Not to mention, The First Strike has numerous problems with continuity and characterization, of which this is the least of them. (The ending sequence with Yuri and Flynn and the movie's villain takes my personal cake for not making any sense with previously-established character traits and in-game dialogue.) If you check on imDB, you'll find that none of the writers for the actual game were involved with The First Strike, and it's not really a rarity for the anime, whether it be TV series, OAV, or movie, to change things from the original game as the writers and producers see fit. If you'd like to smile, the PlayStation 3 version features a cameo from the movie's twins, and Flynn and Yuri have a brief conversation afterwards about how they'd completely forgotten those girls -- and why are they still wearing the uniforms from that time? are they still in the knights? Flynn thought he knew all the current knights -- and isn't all of this REALLY WEIRD?, which seems to point at the PlayStation 3 writers poking fun at the incongruity, especially since none of it is resolved during their sub event and they disappear afterwards, never to be mentioned again. So if you don't like something about The First Strike, I think you should probably feel comfortable ignoring it.
Bandai Namco putting out such a massivly enhanced version of the game with a ton more content than the 360 version. It just seems like they were saying "Hey thanks for buying the game and making it an success in the first place, especially those of you who bought a 360 just to play it, but you know what... Screw You. This is what you get for not waiting to see if we'll put it out on another system with a great deal of new stuff!" Seriously feels like they were trying to piss off 360 owners with that.
- Imagine how people felt in Japan - Tales of Vesperia caused the Xbox 360 to sell out. Imagine how they probably felt to hear about an Updated Rerelease on the PlayStation 3.
- You're blaming the wrong company. Here's the full story: Namco Bandai signed an exclusivity deal with Microsoft that would keep Tales of Vesperia exclusive to the Xbox for one year. These types of exclusivity deals are common, and NCB accepted on the grounds that they could use the money from Microsoft to subsidise the game's production costs, then release a polished version for the PlayStation 3 a year later (where it was expected to make the majority of sales). However, Sony then refused to allow Tales of Vesperia on the PlayStation 3 unless it was substantially different from the Xbox version. This forced Namco Bandai to add in far more content than they otherwise would have. In short, if you're looking to blame anyone for this terrible injustice, blame Sony.
So the conflict between Yuri and Flynn over his killings of Ragou and Cumore. I'm going to put it bluntly: who exactly does the game side with? I've been trying to figure that one out for some time now.
- It doesn't take sides from what I can gather. It's a decision for you to make.
- The game doesn't take either side. Flynn's law and order mentality is considered to be morally better, but fails when the criminals can just use their power and money to get off with little more than a slap on the wrist. Yuri's method is shown to work better in that situation, but is extreme. It's really up to you whether what Yuri did was right or wrong.
- It's both implicitly and explicitly stated to be Step One on a slippery slope: I.e, if Yuri can kill people because he thinks they're wrong, what's to stop other people - villains included - from killing for the same reasons? Unfortunately, many people just assume that Yuri is 100% right... though of course, he is the viewpoint player-character.
- And the whole point of their Duel Boss battle is that they finally reach a compromise and work together instead of butting heads over the differences in their morality. A recurring theme in the game is that different people have different ideas of morality, none of which are inherently superior to one another and many of which are actually mutually exclusive. The game "sides" with the idea that people with such conflicting viewpoints should work together to reach a compromise instead of stubbornly insisting that only one side can be objectively correct.
- Not to mention, when Yuri and Flynn first talk about Ragou, it's clear that Flynn feels helpless and miserable and might be about to take the law into his own hands; Yuri talks him back from that cliff, telling him to just focus on rising up in the ranks until he can deal with someone like Ragou legally, and urging him not to throw away everything he's worked for, before going off to deal with Ragou himself. Yuri thinks Flynn is in the right, and wants to keep him in the right.
Why do people say Yuri killed Cumore? He WAS going to kill Cumore, yes, but Cumore fell his own way. Yuri just didn't offer help. He still didn't finish him off himself.
- Yuri was the reason Cumore fell in the first place. If Yuri hadn't of chased him, he would have never fell, and not helping him in a situation that he directly caused is the same as if he had pushed in Cumore himself, something Yuri himself would likely acknowledge. He may not have hacked Cumore down the way he did Ragou, but lets not kid ourselves, or get bogged down in technicalities, He killed him.
- Intent is what's important. If Cumore had somehow managed to climb out of that pit, Yuri would probably have kicked him back in. Or just impaled him.
- This really bugs me because it's one of the most important plot events in the game. It's the entire reason that Estelle meets Yuri, leaves the castle and pursues Flynn. But it's never explained and the more you think about it, the less it makes sense.
- I'd be inclined to think she saw Zagi roam the castle looking for Flynn in his not-subtle-at-all manner loudly announcing he's going to kill him...or something.
Why wouldn't Belias meet the heroes until the night of a full moon? I mean, just think about how much pain we could have spared everyone if she had just talked to us there and then.
- It's implied that the light of the full moon allows her to make that duplicate of hers in battle. Thus she reserves any personal meetings for that night in order to have a trump card for potential assassination attempts. Kind of makes what happened all the more tragic.
So how did Zagi get to the top of Tarqaron?
Did he sneak in there when it was still ground-bound to hope on ambushing Yuri? I'd assume that's the common thing.
- Didn't Duke hire him to stop and/or delay the party or something? Maybe he went with Duke.
The Hunting Blades are wrong?
The Entelexia indiscriminately slaughtered innocent men, women and children by the millions purely out of petty spite and possibly for sport during the War. Is it so wrong to want justice for such an atrocity? (Not that Humanity is free of heinous actions during the War, but I'm fairly certain they never tried to commit genocide on the Entelexia.)
- It's not about whether the Hunting Blades are right or wrong. It's about the fact that their actions could mean the end of the world and they couldn't care less. It doesn't matter how many of their loved ones were killed by Entelexia if vengeance means dooming everyone else in the process.
- See that whole "Who are you to decide the fate of others" ect ect. It's sort of an overarching theme.
- What?! Where exactly did it say the Entelexeia tried to commit genocide on the humans? From what we know about the War, it stemmed from the Entelexeia trying to force humans to give up their Hermes Blastia -- which were destroying the world -- after humans refused to give the blastia up themselves. And for the record, humanity did attempt genocide on the Entelexeia; that was the purpose behind Tarqaron. This is not to say that the entire race is blameless, but they certainly didn't slaughter millions of humans for the sport of it.
Alexei is behind everything?
Okay, Yeager having been working for Alexei the whole time works, but the game says he was also behind Ragou and Barbos makes no sense giving their plan was to start a war between the knights, which Alexei commanded, and the guilds, and take over afterwords. This game essentially says Alexei started a war that would leave him powerless, and how did Yuri even figure that those were his doing anyways? He just seems to know like he read the script.